Foundation Corona Committee, 96rd meeting on March 18th, 2022
Alex Krainer (former Hedge-Fund-Manager, USA)
in conversation with Viviane Fischer, Reiner Fuellmich
(Original language: English)
[Transcript from Team corona-ausschuss-info.com + Ed]
Reiner Füllmich: [01:11:04]
Alex Krainer. I’m sorry, Alex, to keep you waiting, but it’s almost normal in our sessions. You were able to hear some of what Marquis said. He… really gave a great lecture on democracy. Alex, you’re a former hedge fund manager and energy market specialist, and early in 2021 you pointed out the escalatory nature of the meeting of NATO General Secretary Stoltenberg, Antony Blinken, U. S. Defense Secretary and the Foreign Minister of Ukraine, clearly signaling their plan to have Ukraine join NATO so rapidly. Can you expand on that? … You’re muted.
Alex Krainer: [01:11:57]
I’m sorry. Yeah, well, so first before I begin, thank you very much for having me and thank you very much for doing the work that you do. I think it’s profoundly important and so, to the extent that I can contribute to it, I’m very privileged to join you today. So basically the NATO… has been in in in expansion mode since the very start, since… 1990. And not only has it been in an expansion mode. Practically the whole expansion of NATO has been in the direction of Russia’s borders. Not only by adding 14 countries of the former eastern Warsaw Pact and Croatia and now Macedonia as well. But also by concentrating troops and arsenal closer and closer to Russian borders and even bringing in the nuclear capable strategic bombers from United States.
This is been a process that has been ongoing for a very long time and in parallel there has been systematic deliberate Nazification of Ukraine. This was not by accident; this is determined by where… the money flows. So politically speaking, Nazis are a small fraction in Ukraine, not a large percentage of the population. But they are the principal receivers of the western funding weapons and educational efforts. And educational efforts is something that is kind of overlooked, but since 2003, the NATO and the CIA started very extensive educational program, creating new training camps for these
extreme-right batallions. These camps were built in a way that they could become military bases at a later date.
[01:14:10]
They had over 350 teams of trainers come to Ukraine, some ten thousand instructors. And they’ve been doing this work very consistently. But not only training the military personnel, but also training Ukraine’s policy makers and training their media personalities. They took full control practically of… the Ukrainian media, so that practically no dissenting voices can be heard by the Ukrainian people. And so the… war drums were being heard loud and clear in Russia, because the… process that has been ongoing in Ukraine now for– not just for the 8 years that, since the… coup in 2014, but even longer than that. It has… paralleled the process that was down in… Germany in the 1930s and even… before, even stretching back to 1925 with the… Dawes plan, which basically created the foundations of the German military-industrial complex, which was completely funded by western wall street banks.
So from a Russian point of view, this was a very, very concerning process. And the Russians have very patiently tried to reach a solution, a negotiated solution, to try to obtain necessary written security guarantees from the United States and NATO. But essentially their counterpart spit in their face and said no. And so I think that Russia was brought to– the only choice they had was either to take western powers’ verbal assurances that “No no no, this is no security concern for you. We do not mean to invade.” or to take care of the problem themselves.
[01:16:34]
The Russians, Vladimir Putin, decided to take care of the problem themselves, and on 24th February, they launched their special military operation. Going to war is profoundly risky because if you initiate the war, you might come across all kinds of problems that maybe you could not have anticipated. You will have negative reaction from your own population, which– you know, populations everywhere are viscerally anti-war.
And so the Russians took a calculated risk. However, one thing that jumped out at me when I… conducted my research of the Nazification of Germany 70 and 80 years ago is that before the Munich agreement in 1938, German military, the Nazi war machine, was relatively weak. They were weaker than the Czech military. They were– the… strongest military by far at that time was France. And France and Czechoslovakia where allied. And then there was also the Soviet Union, which itself alone was more powerful than the Nazi military machine. Now, it was clear in 1938 to everybody involved, what the Nazi’s intents were. And it was also clear to everybody including the– Hitler’s general staff that Germany stood no chance against the Czechoslovakia’s military — alone. So if at that time, someone took the decision to have the war, to intervene militarily to, let’s say, demilitarize and denazify the Nazi war machine, there wouldn’t have been World War II. It never would have happened.
[01:18:47]
But because nobody did, because at the time everyone was deferring to London, everybody was in discussions to London, so you know, in spite of the fact that the Soviet Union made several overtures to try to bring together an international coalition to contain Hitler, to contain the Nazi war machine and to deter them, reactions were “No no no, we’re not going to do that. We don’t… want to provoke. We don’t want to rock the boat. We don’t want another big war on the European continent.” And so forth.
So in effect, nobody did anything, and Czechoslovakia was persuaded by the British secret diplomacy to actually stand down, and to disarm, and to simply let Hitler’s troops in, which they did. And they took over the whole country, and once that happened, there was nobody left to… confront the Nazi Germany, particularly after they also took Danzig and… the corridor from Germany in 1939.
So at that point the World War [II] was on the table. And we had tens of millions of casualties, the continent almost completely destroyed. Russia had 16 million casualties, the Soviet Union in total 27 million casualties, complete devastation of its economy. So I think that, on the Russian point of view, the choice was “Do we clean up Ukraine now, while we can? Or do we wait for it to become a large international coalition and this war is forced upon us?”
[01:20:29]
And this is something that was very clear to everyone involved. It wasn’t just the Russians who were being paranoid. Even in the west, the… NATO powers, the United States, they knew that they were preparing for a war. And now there are indications from Russia, which I don’t know if they are, to what extent they are credible. But there were indications that… this war was actually going to be launched imminently, possibly already in February this year, so it might have already been launched. There were credible indications that the western powers actually intended to use nuclear weapons against Russia. And there was also, there were also preparations for Ukraine to retake Crimea by force.
So, there’s a view, and I think it merits attention, that Russia’s military operation in Ukraine was actually done to prevent World War III from erupting. We’re not in the clear yet. But if there’s a hope for this to happen, then I think that any thinking person must hope that the Russian military operation will be successful.
Reiner Füllmich: [01:21:57]
Alex, what do you know about this: we have gotten information that Ukraine was led to believe by NATO and the western forces that they would be supported by NATO and the western forces if they attacked. And then, this kind of support, when the actual war started, didn’t come. Have you heard about this?
Alex Krainer: [01:22:24]
Yes I have heard about this, and this has been clearly a profound disappointment for the… Ukrainians. Yes, they… did expect support from NATO, they were hoping to get the no-fly zone. You know, they– the French and the British were sending their… warships to the Black Sea. So basically, the Ukrainians, or let’s say, not– you know, not the general population, but the… power networks behind the… Zelenskyy government– they were actually preparing for World War III. They actually expected that once the shooting war with the Russian began, that the NATO and the United States would get involved. We can see that from the statements by some of these Nazis who have been through through military training by… NATO. We can see that from the advisors to the Zelenskyy in the private interviews that they’ve given over the over the recent months. They fully expected that World War III was going to break out, that they were going to be the… detonator, that Ukraine was going to be the detonator for it, but that they would get full support from NATO and the… United States.
It wouldn’t be the first time that United States has set up a group or a nation to initiate their war and then decide to cut their losses and bail out. This also happened to the Iraqis.
Reiner Füllmich: [01:24:06]
One thing, Alex.
Alex Krainer:
Yeah, go ahead.
Reiner Füllmich:
Just one thing. You’re… talking about the Nazis over in Ukraine. I have a short clip that we want to show which explains why you’re talking about Nazis, because one of the people, or the person who is in this clip is former member of the American military forces. He explicitly says, “We train Nazis.” Let’s see that.
Video: [01:24:38]
What happened is the United States and European Union mobilized this virulent nationalist group out of Lahov in western Ukraine, among whom were these neo-Nazis who worship Stepan Bandera and the Banderista movement, which was a pro-Nazi Ukrainian national movement, carried out a resistance in that area for decades. These guys came in and took over Maidan violently, overthrew the… legitimate president of Ukraine, and then imposed themselves through force of violence into the Ukrainian body politic.
To give you an example of how powerful they are: when Poroshenko, who was the president before Zelenskyy, negotiated the Minsk Accords in 2015, 2014-2015, he agreed that all they had to do was give special autonomous situation, status, to the Donetz and Lugansk, and they would stay part of Ukraine. He agreed with Germany and France. Then he came back, and the neo-Nazis said, “You try and implement that, we’ll _kill_ you.” Americans get upset with a bunch of rioters taking the capitol and then leaving the same day.
I get upset about it. I’m not happy about it. But the– it ain’t an insurrection. An insurrection is what happened in Ukraine. That’s not being every day. Zelenskyy was told. he was elected to be the president who brought peace. If you remember, Zelenskyy toured the front line because they were supposed to disarm. And he went up to the Azov batallion, and he said, “Disarm.” And they laughed at him, kicked him out. And he said, “I’m the President of Ukraine.” They said, “Shut up. We’ll slap you.” He had to leave. And he was told, “If you sign Minsk, we will hang you by the neck until dead.” That’s the control these people have. And they’ve done it in the military. They– you know, these people should have been disbanded, arrested, shot. Instead, the military absorbed them and then promoted their officers throughout the ranks, so that there’s neo-Nazis everywhere. And the biggest embarrassment of all is when British, American and Canadian troops go to Ukraine to train that military in NATO tactics and NATO equipment, the photograph shows that they’re training the Azov battalion because those are the first units Ukrainian military brought forward for training. We trained Nazis.
Reiner Füllmich: [01:26:58]
So there you have it. Nothing to add to that. But go ahead, Alex.
Alex Krainer:
Yeah, well, you know, I– [why this is unknown] to anyone in the west is because of the… rampant censorship that we’re subjected to. So that the reality of the situation is simply cut out from the picture for most of the consuming public and I think the people who go by the western media think that the… Ukrainian government is about freedom and democracy and the human rights, but no. It is… a nation that is properly being deliberately Nazified. The same thing was done in the 1930s in Germany. This doesn’t happen by accident, because people are not naturally inclined to do these kinds of things. You know, they’re not naturally inclined to lust for war. To prepare for war, to dream about the greatness of nations, and think about the conquering and defeating and destroying other nations. This, you know, this is something that has to be funded and cultivated. And this is being done in… Ukraine on a large scale. It’s not a… you know, it’s… a fringe group in terms of the percentage of population who believes in it, but it’s not a fringe group in terms of the power that they’re being given. The…– two of the most prominent– let’s call them Nazis– in… Ukraine are Mitriarosh and… the other name escapes me. That doesn’t matter.
[01:28:45]
But in 2015 presidential elections, both of them ran. The both of them combined received only two percent of the vote in the presidential elections– together, not two percentag each, two percent the both of them. And… instead of being completely disenfranchised, they received the key cabinet posts though the ministry of defense national security minister of the interior, the police and the ministry of education.
So that the… Nazification could become a proper cultural process in Ukraine, to go into meet the– into… education space, and so forth. And then, of course, you know, the… arming them was important, because these are the people that are the most eager, the most willing to start a war, to engage in aggressive actions. But the tragedy of the Ukrainian society is that these are the people who also tend to be the most viciously cruel towards their own compatriots, if they happen to have a different point of view.
So basically they kept, particularly in places like Kiev, Odesa, Mariupol, they have kept the local population under under… terror, under fear. So the… process of Nazification– denazification– ought to be welcomed by any thinking person anywhere in the world, especially in the west, because we’ve already tried that once. It doesn’t and well for most people at all. It… goes well for the bankers, for the military-industrial complex, but for everybody else, it’s… a tragic catastrophe.
Viviane Fischer: [01:30:45]
I have a question: so the Nazis in Ukraine, like what is it they… like focus mostly on? Like, what’s the Nazi aspect of them, especially? I mean, is it, like antisemitism? Or is it just like, we, I don’t know, it’s like against the Russians? But what’s the– because they are so intertwined with… Russians themselves, you know, Because you have like, a lot of– I mean, did– they’ve been like neighbors for ever, and a lot of people from Ukraine are married to Russians, and there are so many Russians in Ukraine, and like, I mean, what’s the– is there, like a special, like ethnic kind of focus on this Nazi aspect? Or is it just a totalitarian– I mean just in general we are better than what’s the… I don’t know, what’s the focus?
Alex Krainer: [01:31:33]
It’s a… difficult thing to explain, unless you’ve lived it. And I have lived it, because we have the similar rift between Serbs and Croats. And I, I’m Croatian. And I participated in the war in the Balkans in 1990s. But I also happen to be half Serbian, because my parents were a mixed marriage: my mother was Serbian and my father was Croatian. I think that Alexander Solzhenitsyn put it beautifully. Because he also had Ukrainian roots, and he said that Russia and Ukraine– I can… not paraphrase him exactly, but basically he said: something that is treated, is cultivated the right way, Russia and Ukraine can be a beautiful sisterhood. But if you treat it the wrong way, it can become a tragedy.
And I think that, yeah, this is a similar thing that we had in the… Balkans, you know. Like in my– in the case of my family, you know, it can, it could be brotherhood, families intertwined, the men and women intermarrying, the relationship of good neighborliness and constructive cooperation and mutual respect. But it’s very easy to put a spark of distrust and fear. Because you.. start kind of brainwashing one side that the other side wants to destroy them. And this actually happened, you know. There was a– it was a sustained campaign in the Serbian media that Croatian– you know, Croatians actually hate the Serbs and that we plan to exterminate them.
And you know, this was… always the– This is always substantiated by real atrocities that were done in World War II. And so, I think the– to go back to your specific questions, there’s a lot of this in the… minds of the Ukrainian Nazis. And I, as much as I could digest, I… try to listen to their statements, to their interviews. And basically it’s… let’s call it a semi-incoherent… ideology about the greatness of their nation. There’s definitely antisemitism there. There’s definitely ideas that… it’s the Russian Jewish mafia that’s dominating Ukraine, and that they want to clean this all up.
[01:34:19]
And there’s also… pretty much intolerance for everything and anything that’s different from their own world view and their own ideology. So this is no different that we’ve seen among… Croatian nationalists, Serbian nationalists. I think everywhere where people were turned against each other by, you know, by these… techniques of sowing fear of one another among the people.
The same thing is being done in the United States with the, you know, trying to tear it up on racial lines, with with Black Lives Matter and so forth. You simply infuse a group with fear and loathing for others. And then you incite them to… violence. And I think that in…
Reiner Füllmich:
So would you–
Alex Krainer:
Yeah, go ahead, please.
Reiner Füllmich:
Would you agree that… this is not the people themselves who are like this, who are sort of born like this, but this was a– I guess, a kind of a staged war by those who are interested in having this war, rather than fighting the Russians, the Anglo-American financial mafia, as I like to call them– incited this war and had Ukrainians go against Russians. Is– would you agree with that?
Alex Krainer: [01:35:49]
Oh yeah, absolutely. I think there’s no doubt about this. But I think that one thing that needs to be… taken into account. Is the… broader context of this process. And the, you know, in the broadest possible terms, I think this is important to keep in mind, because context is actually everything, to… be able to understand things in a… proper way. We have… a conflict between the empire, or the, you know, “unipolar rules-based global order”, as they… call themselves; and the multipolar world order that is emerging. And so the unipolar world order is…basically a vestige of the British Empire, which has shifted, you know. It has shifted its center of military and diplomatic and economic power to the United States, but the vested interests, the strategies, the ideology still derive from the British Empire.
And so their overarching imperative has been and still is to preserve the hegemony over the Eurasian land mass. And this strategy has been formulated explicitly by Sir Halford Mackinder in… 1904 already. And what he basically said is that to control the world, you have to control the Eurasian land mass. Who controls the heartland controls the… world island basically. And what they mean by that is basically that you have to control the central and eastern Europe in order to control the Eurasian land mass. And controlling central and eastern Europe means that Russia has to be destroyed. It has to be co-opted, regime-changed and partitioned. Their… plan is to partition Russia into four smaller client states. And that’s the only way to control the Eurasian land mass, because it’s not possible to control it militarily. We’ve seen that, you know, they… tried with Afghanistan and they were defeated by… the Taliban World War II weaponry. They had– they tried Iraq, but they’re– Iraq is slipping away. And they had major, massive trouble even just securing the the road between Baghdad and… its airport.
So militarily, this is just not possible to do. So what you do is you partition political entities and you turn them against one another through you know, secret diplomacy and intelligence work. And that allows your banks to finance the corporations you control to extract the natural resource wealth from this continent. And to financialise it in your own markets. So… that the… this wealth accrues to… you, to your banks.
[01:38:58]
And obviously this cannot be done if the region is controlled by Russia, China and Iran as the regional powers. So this is the prime reason why they want to, they’re desperate to destroy Russia. This strategy was not forgotten in 1904 when Mackinder wrote it down. It was… reformulated by Zbigniew Brzezinski in 1997 in his book “The Grand Chessboard”, where he spelled out why it was important for them to control Eurasian land mass. And basically it’s down to resource wealth, is down to the… fact that it has the, two-thirds of the world GDP, and that it accounts for 70 percent of the global energy reserves. And then the last time this strategy was explicitly formulated was in 2018 when the Undersecretary of State for Eurasian and European Affairs, Wes Mitchell, briefed it in those terms to the U.S. Senate Foreign Relations Committee. This was August 15, 2018. And in that briefing, Wes Mitchell basically said to the U.S. Senate Foreign Relations Committee that the United States is working with its ally the United Kingdom to create an international coalition to confront Russia, and that this was the highest priority of the U.S. foreign policy.
So you know, none of these facts are lost on the Russians. They see what is being prepared, and the… war in Ukraine is basically their… action to preempt what is… being planned.
Reiner Füllmich: [01:40:52]
So is there any way out of this?
Alex Krainer:
Yes. The… way out of this is that we… resist the call to war. Namely, you know, we’ve seen history of world wars. It doesn’t happen all in one day. There are people who are reluctant to go there are people who have… who hesitate. There are also diplomatic efforts to persuade them to join the war. Okay, so it takes time to form a coalition. It takes time to persuade people to join the war effort. And as we know, that the United States itself has joined both wars kind of late in the game, because it took… a lot of propaganda on the United States and its people. And it took, actually, a major false-flag event to persuade them to say, like, “Okay, now we’re going to join the fight; we’re going on defeat the bad guys.”
So we are in danger of seeing another false-flag event. We see that the British, the NATO, the United– _certain_ powers in the United States are working very very hard to create this international coalition to persuade, you know, the Poles, the Germans, the Italians to provide weapons. From there it’s a question of maybe one catalyzing event to, you know, polarize public opinion and to create a critical mass of people who will be willing to join the war against Russia and to get this World War III going.
[01:42:36]
So, obviously the information blockade is part of that, because we need to demonize the other side. We need to not allow for any kind of a nuanced, balanced discussions to happen. So first of all, again, speaking the truth is perhaps the the only cure to this, to the deception that is… used to engineer consent for war. And then we need to… we need to resist the demonization of Russia. I want to say something for– you know, I believe that most of your listeners and viewers, anyway, are already inclined to have a more balanced view of things. But, you know, the way western public knows that Vladimir Putin is bad and that Russia is evil– is because their media has been pumping that message into the information space relentlessly since 2004.
And… a few years ago, Vladimir Posner, one of the Russian-American media people who was was quite famous in the United States in the 1990s. He himself paid a group of researchers to go into the archives of the New York Times. And over a three-year period– I think it was 2015-2016- 2017– to comb through all the stories published in The New York Times about Russia, and to try to find one that presented Russia in positive light. And they found none, none, zero.
So you know that’s– that… cannot be done by accident. You know there. You you can’t have a nation with absolutely zero redeeming qualities, that you cannot write even a single positive story about Russia whatever, about some of its sports teams or their Bolshoi Ballet or, you know, there’s… very good things to be said about Russia, even if… you don’t like that it’s political leadership. You could find interesting, inspiring stories. But there were none. So that indicates that there’s a deliberate policy being implemented, to only present Russia in a negative light.
[01:45:05]
I think that, in a way, that itself maybe weakens the message a little bit, because people, most people, are not stupid. They can… they understand that, you know, if somebody’s being presented in a negative light all the time, nonstop, relentlessly, that this is being done deliberately. And so that the truth is something else. And I think that for us to… prevent this flight to war, I think we need to speak the truth. We need to not hesitate. Obviously, the price can be very high,
Reiner Füllmich:
Um-hm.
Alex Krainer:
as the… I forget his name right now, but the German Vice Admiral found out in January when he said, Hey you know, the low cost of resolving this problem with Ukraine would be to deal with Russia with respect and to give them the respect that they demand and deserve. And his military career ended that day.
Reiner Füllmich:
Exactly.
Alex Krainer:
So you understand that the price is right, but the censors and the repress– censorship and repression cannot handle a tsunami, you know. They can handle the Vice Admiral, they can handle a single journalist or several journalists. They cannot handle any percentage of the rf millions of people. So you know, even… for people who are not prominent, who are not famous. They need to try to influence… individuals in their surroundings, to the extent that they can, because truth matters a great deal. And if we don’t want our children to end up first first as cannon fodder in a World War III, and then as… human livestock in the New World Order that they have planned for us, I think the most important thing we can do is to… have a backbone and to speak the truth. And not only to _speak_ the truth, but to research it, to find it. It’s– you know, it was American Reverend Thomas R. who said it’s a Christian’s duty to know the truth. It’s not just “would be nice”. It’s your duty to understand the truth.
Viviane Fischer:
That is so crazy, you know, that today, like especially with this like, still lingering nuclear threat, that you would even like, try to… resolve something with a war. I mean, I think this is so yesterday, and so, you know, I mean, there… must be other possibilities. And I mean, I… think that this, these– I mean, I… I’m kind of dubious about these Nazis there in… the Ukraine. And I think, you know, when you… consider that in Germany, we have had this– or I think it’s, it’s at least irrelevant, the NPD party, you know, these like, neo-nazi party that at some point the… Supreme Court basically wanted to, do you know, were in the process of looking if they could be like, made illegal here. And then they said, they– in fact, they said, well, this party, the members are basically indistinguishable from the German secret service. You know, it… was like, fully, it was basically like people pretending to be Nazis, like playing a role of Nazis, you know, coming up with like, strong words, blah blah blah, racism or whatever.
But then it turns out it’s the government itself. So basically the… judges said, we cannot even, like, declare this illegal, you know, because then we would declare parts of the government illegal, basically. You know, I mean, it was like a bizarre situation. And, I mean, could this not also be, that this whole, like, agenda of… like, you know, the Nazis in Ukraine, the Nazis, that that’s if, in fact like a _big show_. And it’s not even like, I mean, maybe some people maybe you have then brought in people who have this kind of, a little bit of this attitude, and they now bring it forward with like conviction. But it’s not– they wouldn’t have never, you know, gotten to this position had they not been pushed by… the secret service or like, whatever, like entities pulling the strings behind them?
Alex Krainer: [01:49:23]
Yes and no. I think that the situation in general is very different to the one in Ukraine, because in Germany, you know, there is still a great deal of resistance to Nazis, and so these… people that you speak of, like basically deep-state enforcement type of… a person like secret police type of a person, and I think that this is exactly the same level of Nazification that we have in Croatia. You know, they attempt to show that it’s some kind of a viable political movement, but in the… end, you find out that this it’s… a very small group of people, that end up getting then disproportionate media coverage. Because, you know, because they’re interesting, because they’re scary, because they’re controversial, whatever.
[01:50:10]
But in Ukraine. you actually had a legal and educational framework being set up to take these seeds and to cultivate them into a larger political movement. So, you know, one of the first laws the the coup government enacted in 2015 was to make it illegal to criticize and condemn the Nazi collaborators, like Stepan Bandera from World War II. And then they started naming streets and squares around Ukraine, and schools, with the name of those Nazi collaborators. They started kind of presenting them back to the public as people who were fighting for Ukrainian, you know, greatness and independence and so forth, and against the communists. and against the Jews and against the Germans and so forth. Not against the Germans, sorry, but, you know, in that sense.
And so, you know, one of the– it’s even taken very cynical proportions, to where you have– in Kiev, you have the Stepan Bandera Boulevard, which ends at the… monument to Bobbiard where, you know, tens of thousands of Jews were slaughtered by Stepan Banderas collaborators. So the, I think that the difference between Germany and Ukraine is that the German seeds are not being cultivated. Wehereas in… Ukraine, they’re being actively and abundantly cultivated. So you… do attract a certain profile of a person, particularly young, impressionable males, who maybe don’t find any other kind of affirmation in life, other than joining some kind of a national movement with which they identify, which gives them a sense of meaning and a sense of purpose.
[01:52:20]
And, you know, they are part of something historic and great. And then they become even willing to sacrifice themselves and to sacrifice others, and to inflict violence on others who are not willing to do what they’re willing to do.
Viviane Fischer:
But how… big is the influence really on the the people? I mean, like in the sense of, yeah, you have these, whatever, infiltrates, and maybe people who like, do you know, hop on the opportunity to… you know, show themselves in public with this, like, strong, do you know, aggressive speech or whatever. And then, and these renaming of streets– I mean, that’s very interesting. But how much does this really get to the… normal Ukrainian guy, you know? I mean, is this not… fully like, out of proportion to, like– if you… take away the media hype, you know, also the maybe internal, Ukraine, Ukrainian internal media hype about these people, is there, do they really have so many followers in the Ukraine?
Alex Krainer: [01:53:26]
Probably not, but, you know, the– a small minority of determined and violent people can have disproportionate influence. And, again, I think we can look at Nazi Germany as a precedent, because, you know, unlike history they teach us in school, Nazis were _not_ popular in Germany. And even in… their best showing, with all the very abundant funding that they received from banks and the corporations, like IG Farben and so forth, the… highest mark they ever reached– and that’s also probably with quite a bit of election engineering– was 37 percent. They never received the majority of the German vote. But nevertheless, you know, once… you have these deep crises, these… war emergencies, the… public opinion polarises.
[01:54:28]
So first the… Nazis themselves keep the population under kind of a reign of terror, where different kinds of opinions or not welcome. And then, when there’s… a war emergency, then the… public opinion polarises to the point where “you’re with us or against us”, you know. The… any kind of a nuanced discussion about where we want to be– do we want to be closer to the Russians, to the west, or this– it all falls away, and the whole nation has to close ranks behind their leadership, whether they like them or not, you know. “We’ll discuss things after the war, but now we have to go and fight the Russians, and at that point, you know, you can have substantially the whole nation kind of coalescing into an aggressive war effort.
And this is exactly the process that we saw in Germany. It’s not the Germans one day decided, “Yeah we want to conquer…the world, we want to… defeat the, all the other countries and be the ruler of Europe.” This happened gradually, and again, from small seeds, because for the longest time, Nazis we’re not popular in Germany at all.
Reiner Füllmich: [01:55:45]
Well, the only way out is to keep exposing everything and keep telling the truth. And you probably know that Professor Mattias Desmet– the professor of psychology from Belgium– he says exactly the same thing. Because all of… what we’re seeing, or most of what we’re seeing is the grand illusion created through psychological terrorism basically. Or what he called it “mass formation”. So I suppose that _is_ the only way out, because, you know, last night I spoke with my neighbors in California, and they told me this is exactly what’s happening in the US right now. They’re trying to… get people so upset about Ukraine that they’re all going to unite behind their leader, even though Biden is probably one of the most unpopular presidents ever.
That’s why the only way out is to keep exposing the truth, get it all out and get as many people as possible to know this. That’s our only hope, I think.
Alex Krainer:
I… fully agree, but I would… also like to give you a little bit of an optimistic viewpoint on this. And I… think that right now– I’m… glad you mentioned Mattias Desmet’s mass formation hypothesis, mass formation psychosis hypothesis, because I think that what we’re experiencing now is similar to what we experienced in the early days of the corona pandemic.
Reiner Füllmich:
Oh yeah.
Alex Krainer:
However, first of all, people by now are much more cued in to the fact that there’s… very heavy-handed censorship going on. I think that there’s a… silent majority who is not convinced by the mainstream narrative. I think that the illusion is being maintained and reinforced by the loudest of the shrieking zealots who are dominating the discourse and the media space. And that the silent majority actually is very, very unconvinced. And you know, right now, speaking out has a high cost. But I think that as the dust settles, more and more people will see the truth, and they’re going to speak out.
Two days ago exactly, I watched randomly the little biographical video about Vladimir Putin. So somebody put together like, a 10-minute bio, very non-controversial, basically just telling the story of Vladimir Putin’s life, you know. He went to the school and then he became– he studied this and became a KGB agent, then went to xxxxx. You know, nothing about whether he’s good or bad, just a story of his life. But then I scrolled through the comments– and there were hundreds of them, because this was posted already a year ago– and some of the comments were very recent, so no, virtually– most of the comments were since, after the invasion of Ukraine. And would you believe me, I could not find _one_ that was negative, in the sense of saying “We must stop Putin”, “He’s a bad man. Somebody ought to take him out” or something like this. The man obviously commannds respect beyond Russia’s borders, whether people agree with him or not about this Ukrainian invasion. But he commands respect, and I think that, at this stage at the very least, people given him the benefit of the doubt, that if he invaded Ukraine, maybe he had a good reason for this.
[01:59:33]
So I think that as the dust settles, as the shrieking zealots get tired, and as they, you know, disqualify themselves by, you know, obviously talking nonsense, as they tend to– I think that the truth will emerge. And it will– the picture that emerges will probably be very radically different from the… mainstream narrative that… we are being fed today.
Reiner Füllmich:
Very obviously, yeah. Well, Alex, under the circumstances, I must say this was a great pleasure. I am very, very happy that you took the time and spoke on our, on this Corona Committee session. I know that most people are probably enlightened now, because many people just don’t know what’s really going on. You put a very, very important piece of the puzzle into the puzzle. Things are becoming much clearer now because of you. Thank you so much.
Alex Krainer: [02:00:37]
It’s my pleasure and privilege. And thank you very much for having me. And once more, thanks from the heart for all the work that you do, you are doing. And I’ve been following it pretty much since the beginning.
Reiner Füllmich:
Great. Well, it’s all of us together, Alex. We’ll keep it together.
Alex Krainer:
Exactly.
Reiner Füllmich:
OK.
Alex Krainer:
Thank you very much, and I look forward to keeping in touch.
Reiner Füllmich:
Thank you very, very much. Have a great weekend.
Alex Krainer:
You, too. Thank you. Bye-bye.
Reiner Füllmich: [02:01:02]
Thank you.
