Foundation Corona Committee, 45th meeting on March 26, 2021
Katy Pracher-Hilander (psychologist, management consultant, Austria)
Katy Pracher-Hilander talks about the psychological terror that the governments
is exercised on the population (psychological warfare).
in conversation with Viviane Fischer and Reiner Fuellmich
(Original language: German)
[Transkript vom Team corona-ausschuss-info.com +]
Reiner Fuellmich [03 .03.12]
Now we would have to Ms. Dr. Katy Pracher-Hilander on the line.
Katy Pracher-Hilander
Yes, and if you omit the doctor, we are correct.
Reiner Fuellmich
OK everything good. Have you heard our previous session?
Katy Pracher-Hilander
Yes, I saw a lot today. I ran it on the side.
Reiner Fuellmich
Very good. We are with you in the field of psychology. From my point of view, that is the core problem that we are dealing with here. I would describe what is happening here as psychological terror, this targeted destabilization, this targeted disorientation of the public with increasingly contradicting and increasingly brazen guidelines from politics. At the end of the day, some of our “own people”, with whom we want to conquer the problem, are almost desperate. That Prof. Bhakdi, who like Wolfgang Wodarg was one of the first to get involved, slowly no longer knows what to say about it. That is understandable. But we mustn’t let that confuse us. Because that is the aim of the action. How do you see the situation?
Katy Pracher-Hilander
Just like you, of course. For me it started in such a way that I already knew in March 2020 that it stinks to heaven. I think everyone who somehow has all the cups in the cupboard noticed relatively early on that something was wrong. It was just the vocabulary: “new normal”, “we are at war”, “we need heroes”. The vocabulary was used far too early. That raised the alarm for me because I knew we still knew too little about this virus. We have so little data that it cannot be that they can use such a valid vocabulary here. So it stinks to heaven, so there is something else there. And then came these forced images from Bergamo. Plus the numbers that
Beginning at the back and the front didn’t go together at all. At the beginning I was shocked and quickly knew that we were really in a psychological experiment here. Attempts are currently being made here to manipulate eight billion people around the world. Right from the start, I called it the greatest social-psychological experiment in human history. And this socio-psychological experiment is needed in order to get this experiment going on at all. Because if you don’t have people spiritually where you want them to be, then they don’t get involved in this experiment either. That is, in parallel it needs
It is precisely this massive psychological impact, because otherwise the same thing happens as with swine flu: no one is interested in the topic.
Reiner Fuellmich
Some people here may now ask themselves: “Why does she know that?” Can you briefly say something about your background?
Katy Pracher-Hilander
I am an economic and social psychologist. I do applied psychology in practice. That’s why I also recognize signals. I am fortunate that I recognize the theory in practice and, conversely, can also reflect it. I’m at home in business, but also partly in politics. And live near Vienna. So I’m not in Germany, I’m in Austria.
Reiner Fuellmich
What we experience really seems like the greatest social psychological experiment in human history. According to our knowledge, it is probably a relatively small number of people who control the whole thing, maybe there are 3,000 super-rich who stand behind the corporations and who earn a lot of money with it. The fact that these few people bring such a large number of other people under control allows only one conclusion that this is about psychological manipulation, about mental manipulation.
Katy Pracher-Hilander
We are dealing with massive psychological manipulation here, as you said at the beginning. It’s psychological warfare. These signs, these indicators can be heard, read, seen. Any psychologist who wants to can do it. Unfortunately in our department it is also the case that many colleagues look the other way or do not trust each other. Many don’t realize it either. That affects me very much. But I think that if you have studied that and should actually have to recognize it blindly without looking at pictures – a little text and facial expressions are enough – then everyone should have recognized it immediately. At least those in my field who are social psychologists. But as in
In other professional groups, such as doctors, journalists, lawyers, it is exactly the same with my professional group that a lot of them have obviously not understood it themselves and have also become victims of manipulation. As paradoxical as it is, it really is.
And only a few see it, understand it and then dare to come out. I was only contacted by a colleague 14 days ago because she saw me at an interview and then contacted me with: “Thank you, someone finally speaks out”. And the day will come when she will also have to show her colors and then she will take the right side and oppose it. She is still in professional life, wears a mask, but tries to resist where possible.
Reiner Fuellmich
So it means that there are a lot of people out there who either already know or at least strongly assume that something is wrong here. But at the moment they are still under cover because they believe they cannot afford it.
Katy Pracher-Hilander
Yes that is the problem. And in the end it is like this: none of us can really afford it. But there is no alternative.
Reiner Fuellmich
That is the point. There is no alternative.
Katy Pracher-Hilander
There is no alternative. Exactly, because otherwise we wouldn’t all be sitting here now. And we can only hope that we mobilize enough that more and more people will see that it is of no use. Because it is the case that the crowd has been waiting and hoping for twelve months. Psychologically, she is always put off with this salami technique. If you asked me how can you make it clumsier, I wouldn’t think of anything. Yes, it just doesn’t get any more clumsy. And the frightening thing is that we all see that obviously the most primitive of all mechanisms have such an effect.
I am convinced that psychologists are at work here. It cannot be otherwise. They simply opted for the black side of power and are active in an advisory capacity. That means they will have planned that too. I recognize the handwriting, it’s just there. Scary enough. But the thing is, now we have to try to get people out of cover and mobilize them. This salami tactic is crude. But humans are just not very complex, to put it that way. We work very, very simply. We may have chosen ourselves to be the crown of creation, but we are actually not complex at all. We are very, very easy to steer. If I want something from someone, I just have to know: where do I start, what do I say, how do I do it. And then I get what I want, and the other person is helpless.
Reiner Fuellmich
Fortunately, it doesn’t work for everyone, otherwise we wouldn’t be able to talk like that here. We have had Prof. Georg Lind on the Corona Committee twice. He pointed out that a functioning democracy requires people to have moral literacy. This in turn requires two elements, namely on the one hand the ability to ask questions instead of blindly following orders, and on the other hand the ability to discuss other opinions instead of just putting them down in general terms.
To be crushed with blanket terms such as “right-wing radical”, “anti-Semitic” or “Martian”. And that, he says, is likely to be present in 20 percent of the population, but not in 80 percent of the population. But it could be practiced relatively easily, at least that’s what he said.
In the USA it’s very different. It’s about 50/50 there. The attitudes follow the party lines. One side says: it’s all crap that happens here, even if you don’t understand in detail what exactly is happening. But emotionally very many understand it and see that something is wrong. The other side says: we need to have more masks. I’ve always meant that as a joke, but the fact is, there are people in the US now who actually wear two masks. Including Joe Biden, who you don’t even know if he is Joe Biden. It’s scary.
You just said that these are very simple mechanisms. I find it amazing how effective this clumsy manner, this audacity is. For example, when I look at this strange Mr. Wieler from the RKI, who sits down and says, it will now be done as I say it and it must not be questioned. Is it really so simple that it is just so bold that the majority of the population can no longer imagine that this is a massive abuse of power, a massive attempt at deception?
Katy Pracher-Hilander
It will definitely be the case that it is really so brazen and clumsy that you can no longer suspect a lie behind it at all. Who would throw the truth in my face so clumsily?
There are of course a lot of factors that play a role. One thing is this belonging to the authorities, which we of course have developed well in our culture, which means that you have a lot of cultural factors. Of course, they play a role.
In other words, it makes sense when you get such a campaign rolling that you actually look at the country cultures very specifically and pick out the weak points here. You just see how individual cultures tick. Then I can present it in a relatively tailor-made way: where do I proceed, how do I proceed.
We humans naturally have a very strong urge to conform. I think you already have the example of the “AschConformity Experiment” here in the Corona Committee[https://de .wikipedia.org/wiki/Konformit%C3%A4tsexperiment_von_Asch] discussed. [Eight young men sit in a row. You see four lines. Have the men say: how long is the first line? Is its length the same as the length of some other line (A, B, or C)? The first seven men are initiated and knowingly give the wrong answer. The eighth man is the test subject. He does not manage to give an independent answer to the pressure to conform. Although the correct answer is obvious, he joins the wrong answers of the others.] The experiment showed that people fail even at such simple things as admitting that a line does not correspond to what the crowd said. Even then, strangers did not manage to say to a group of 7 others: “Sorry, but you were wrong, because line A does not correspond to this.” We can’t even do it there.
Even there we don’t have the courage – and you really only need a little bit of courage when it comes to lines – to locate ourselves correctly and to oppose the majority opinion. And this is the problem.
We always want to be adjusted, we want to be liked, we don’t want to be excluded. It’s a primal instinct. And, unfortunately, very many obviously have a massive impact on this. On the other hand, morality is no longer so important. This is because conformity is there regardless of whether the other person’s attitude or behavior is correct. That said, it has nothing to do with the fact that as soon as I realize, hey, you’re talking utter nonsense, that at the moment I say that’s not true. In fact, this knowledge has no influence on me. I still take part because I want to be part of it.
And then somehow picking up people, taking away their fear of non-conformity or giving them courage, that’s important. Then you have to see how you give everyone the tools for themselves in their microcosm.
We all have the power to make a difference in our microcosm, with friends, neighbors and colleagues. Everyone has to see how they can start.
You can learn a lot from legal psychology: How can I convince others or how can I form a majority in the minority. We know that from jury courts. In the USA in the 1970s there was a lot of discussion between psychologists and lawyers or courts as to whether there should be six or twelve jurors. Some judges have said six jury members are enough. Psychologists and social psychologists said no, it should be twelve. You have justified it in such a way that the probability is mathematically higher that with twelve jurors there is a lateral thinker than with only six jurors, where it is easier to form a majority. If there is a lateral thinker among twelve jurors, then he only needs to get a second to his side and there is an imbalance. And you start to waver in your attitude.
This is such a simple example – you can also do it in your office, with colleagues. I know my colleagues, I know what makes them tick. I can just look at which of these colleagues I could most easily motivate to talk to. We’ll get a colleague on board and then gradually proceed slowly. You have to be patient, but trust is the key to convincing others. It can be that you simply prove yourself to be reliable by simply doing something for your colleague, relieving them of work, simply showing that I am reliable. That means, if I do and say something, then I can be trusted, I am trustworthy. That is the point. Politicians are
not necessarily trustworthy now, as well as everyone knows, but for some reason they were chosen anyway. That means that you are a little more sure about that.
And in the end, that’s what we get from the “Milgram Experiment”[https://de .wikipedia.org/wiki/Milgram-Experiment] know. In this experiment we saw the following: someone supposedly electrocuted someone and they screamed and I kept going anyway. Why am i doing this?
Because in the end I am not responsible for it. And that’s the problem with the doctors that we’ve heard a lot from too. They take part because they are not psychologically responsible. As long as they can hide behind a Milgram experiment, it is very difficult to lure them out of the reserve and admit: that has nothing to do morally with my professional ethics, so now I have to press the stop button. Unfortunately that’s how it is. It’s a simple mechanism, but, as we can see, it works wonderfully with academics too. It makes no difference whether you are an academic or whether you have never attended school at all. On the contrary. I feel like that sometimes
suggest that the less educated, so to speak, have it much more pronounced up here. They still have a feeling, a gut feeling. Maybe more honor in the bones.
Reiner Fuellmich
That’s correct. Just struck me again yesterday. I must have been with 100 taxi drivers. Almost all of them know what’s going on. Yesterday someone was very skeptical, but after half an hour’s drive we had started talking, so he said, I’ll look at that, it was very informative now. It’s usually very difficult out there.
[Your example with the jury is great. That is encouraging. If there is someone in a group of jury who sees things differently and if he then manages to turn things around, then it means that we can do that too. One juror does it by gaining trust, by being authentic. And then the others trust him, then they believe him. …]
I lived in the USA for a long time. When that OJ Simpson thing [OJ Simpson was charged with murdering his wife and boyfriend] I was still in Los Angeles. After that there were two trials, a criminal trial that he won and a civil trial that he lost. Everyone asks, how can that be, I would say that a few mistakes were made by the public prosecutor at the time, but it was also down to the jury selection.
This process is called “Voir dire”. As lawyers of the two different sides, you look for a pool that is available as a jury, in that case it was, I think 500 or more, because it was a big process, you choose the people. And as a lawyer you try to recognize that he can fit, is someone I can use. Since the other side does exactly the same thing, in the end it is as if you had thrown the dice, because one side doesn’t get through any more than the other side. That would be a miracle.
It is actually a good example that even if there are twelve people and even if 90 percent are on the other side, so to speak, you can still turn things around with one person.
Katy Pracher-Hilander
Yes, you definitely can. And something else interesting from legal psychology. How can I prepare fabric? What tactics do I have the best chance of winning? We know, for example, that a chronological processing of evidence leads to a victory much higher than using the “best witnesses” or “bringing the best witnesses to the end”. It does not matter whether it is about the defendant or the prosecutor. This effect has already been measured a few times on both sides.
That means, for example, that I simply put my arguments into a logical chronology. With this, people may also be able to make sense of what is going on. That means, you don’t just say: “The PCR test sucks”, you give a little more input. What was before What is after? You then spin a red thread, a spiritual red thread. I think that with that I will feel a lot more secure and that I can agree with that because it makes sense and the whole story
is not torn out of context. I also try to take such little tricks out of psychology in practice. Then I translate them for my setting, wherever I need it. Of course I do that here too, in this huge experiment. And as I said, everyone has their own microcosm and can fall back on such small aids there.
And what else is important. Today’s meeting of the Corona Committee runs under the title “Can arithmetic be a sin.” The topic of mathematics and numbers is an interesting starting point for me. It is interesting that we have a sticking point when we actually get out of a topic mentally. When do we lose track of things? This is the case in every setting.
In a normal environment, we have this crux of six to seven pieces of information. With six pieces of information, most of them cognitively drop out and mentally only have a wishy-washy. You will then find it difficult to assess the situation clearly. By the way, in legal psychology, when it comes to judgments, we know that the sticking point is three to four. So the numerical value is different there. That can be measured. If a judge has three to four accused in the dock who are sitting there because of some offenses in the group, then from this number of accused the judges’ verdicts always become a cross-sectional guilty verdict. This means that they are less differentiated in terms of content, because the judges simply can no longer cognitively process the individual information. In their distress, they then tend to form a cross-section. In other words, there are a lot of things that can be simply kept in mind for practice and now for our work of persuasion. Then you can pull them out as if from a bag of tricks.
Viviane Fischer
You raised the issue of trust and I have a question about that. It is fascinating that even within long friendship relationships we have a completely insurmountable camp formation. That is very peculiar. These are actually people who have known each other from childhood or have always been in good contact for many years. You should know that the other person is totally reliable, doesn’t usually tell rubbish, and isn’t a conspiracy theorist. And suddenly you nevertheless have the situation that this original relationship of trust no longer supports when you are discussing the current situation. How do you explain that?
Katy Pracher-Hilander
There will be several factors. One is our innate character formation, how we simply tick. Whether we orient ourselves very much towards others or whether we define ourselves through ourselves. In other words, the more I define myself about myself, the less susceptible I am to other people’s opinions. That’s me and you will be too. I form my own opinion and I don’t care what others think of me. So the ego identity is very important. The less I have them, the more I’m out and about as a bobble dog.
And of course the fear factor plays a big role. That means, if I’m really scared now and my counterpart says you don’t need that, then it brings me into a certain reactance position. Because actually I want my opinion to be confirmed and the more you insist on it, that’s nonsense, the more you drive me away, because then you don’t take me seriously and I lose confidence in your story again. That is a thesis that is very plausible.
And besides, when looking for an opinion or an explanation, we naturally always filter out in our environment that which actually corresponds most to our attitude. We hide everything else. This is a perfectly normal mechanism. That means, if I just lump these three examples together, then we already have a huge potential of how I can topple friendships and long-term relationships overnight. That happens relatively quickly.
And politics wanted it that way too. This division in society did not just happen, but it is a central mechanism of action, it is a central lever that you activated very quickly. I would have suggested that to them, if I had now also been one of the evil psychologists, because with that the masses of course now take on the social police role. That means the police don’t have to interfere much. Politicians don’t have to do anything big because “whistling each other” overnight even becomes a civic duty. This is completely perverse. But in this way they have arranged it relatively well beforehand that that is exactly what happens. But then they pretend to be big
up, pretend innocent and tell people: “We have to stick together, we have to stick together, blah, blah, blah, blah”.
Reiner Fuellmich
We have come to a central point. We were all able to observe the course of events, but to draw the conclusion that the whole thing is staged, i.e. planned, most people have not yet been able to do that. That’s my conviction too, after all I’ve heard.
But how did you find out that this is a plan that is now being implemented by the politicians. Are there also some who just play along and have no idea, or are the people who now set the tone, those who know exactly what they are doing?
Katy Pracher-Hilander
I think a great many of those who set the tone don’t really know what they’re doing. It really seems to me that there are a lot of hollow heads on the way. Very few in the background will know what they are doing and why they are doing it. And the others are executive organs. It’s always like this Milgram experiment. People just do it because it is ordered. And as long as I am not liable for it and as long as the other others order it, I am basically just the messenger. They could say yes no, and it’s their own fault if they do it anyway. I am just the mouthpiece. I am no more than that. I am the nuncio who used to walk from A to B. I do not do more. And therefore
I don’t have to deal with it either.
And the whole thing is forced by, for example, throwing a wording into the room, such as “these are conspiracy theorists”. This is a means by which a wedge has been driven into society in a very manipulative way. You are the good guys who do what we say. And the others are the bad guys. And we have to take care of each other, you have a responsibility for that. That means, people were suggested to get going, stick out the index finger and see what the others are doing. At the same time, the carpet was rolled out with, “Yes, we have to look a little bit at the neighbor” and it was said, “Because this is now for the protection of the group, we have to see how he behaves”. And it was said that we have to make sure that we wear the masks, otherwise grandma and grandpa will get sick. That means, those who don’t do it want my grandma and grandpa to get sick, they are then the murderers. Sometimes they did it very subtly, but with the wording “aluminum hat wearer” and “conspiracy theorist” they were again very, very clumsy. Precisely because they didn’t say, folks, we would have loved to split you, because then you would bang each other’s heads in and with a bit of luck there will be no one left on either side.
Viviane Fischer
I also find it interesting that there was some praise for certain behavior. There were these commercials with the weird “sofa heroes” who stood for the new “stay at home” and lay lazily on the sofa. So you can interpret the caress for actually behaving as politics dictates. So it was not only threatened, which one absolutely must do, it was also praised. This has created a community of “sofa heroes” that no longer criticizes anything.
Katy Pracher-Hilander
That’s part of it. This conditioning through punishment and praise. That’s part of it. This is completely normal. It’s like the experiments that people used to do with the rat: if you’ve done well, you’ll get treats, if not you’ll get an electric shock. It’s basically the same. It’s just normal, classic conditioning. It is really the simplest mechanisms that work really well here. And of course it has been going on for twelve months now. You should think that after twelve months, a lot of people should have strapped in. No, on the contrary. Politics is doing something very, very well here: we’ve been living with distractions for twelve months. From the actual goal, from the actual core of the topic, there is massive distraction, so that people cannot mentally concentrate on the topic at all. And that attention span gets high all the time
held. People have been in a constant state of tension for twelve months, mentally and physically. If we were to measure, the adrenaline levels would be completely different from two years ago. That means, this stress hormone is there, it is released permanently. But what the politicians have paid close attention to is that it doesn’t get used to it
leads. Because even if I’m constantly under tension, mind and body get used to it. Care has been taken to ensure that there is a habituation effect here, but that this attention span is designed to be curvy. That is, lockdown yes, lockdown no. Then there is a goodie again, praise, then back up with the punishment, then bring in any other topics, like suddenly the children come into the game.
That means, if you look at the topics, something new is always woven into it, like in a huge braid. This is done so that the focus is constantly directed to the wrong things, that people do not get to the core at all and do not get into the position at all to actually think about the topic. They are constantly distracted and constantly at a certain level of stress, but with certain curves so that they don’t get used to it and are then relaxed again, despite the stress in the blood. That means it’s very, very perfidious.
And they have to do that, because otherwise they cannot keep seven to eight billion people on a leash for a year, and that will go on for a long time. You have to come up with a little something. The last things then were the mutations that came overnight. If perhaps the level of attention declines a bit, then mutations are of course very beneficial, to put it that way. And they appear at the same time as Brexit, even on the same day. Even something like that is no longer noticeable.
Nobody cares about that. It’s wonderfully distracted. Not all of them, of course, but the bulk of them. And the great mass is that we humans
not coping well with this tragic truth and naturally wanting to hide it. And then of course there is the mechanism to gloss over it and hope.
Here in Austria – and it is no different in Germany – we are always sworn to the fact that the next fortnight will be decisive.
Obviously it still works for many, although in reality they already know that it will not be the case again. But here I have a little bit of hope, because otherwise I actually have to deal with the topic now. And actually I don’t feel like it now. So we do it again for a fortnight.
Reiner Fuellmich
That is the point. When you say we are being distracted, we always look where they want us to look, namely in the direction of “pandemic, pandemic” and “you have to wear masks!” And whatever. At the same time, of course, we notice that something is happening next to it, namely a major change in society.
As lawyers, we can see what is happening in the form of the destruction of the rule of law. The dissolution of the rule of law structures, in which people who have nothing to do with the rule of law suddenly give commands.
And the rule of law stands by and puts up with it. This seriously damages democracy. I said recently at the demo in Kassel: that is
the worst attack on democracy ever. These are things that you can see. You just have to look.
What you can’t see so well is what’s behind it and what goal is being pursued. But you can also see that when you look at the connections. It runs on the simple psychological line, namely: just make it obvious, then nobody will guess that this is intended anyway. There is a thought that what is happening is the Great Reset. And you just have to look into Klaus Schwab’s book, then you can see that it is about population reduction and control of the population, among other things. Have I misrepresented something now?
Katy Pracher-Hilander
No not at all. It really is so absurd. Facts have been on the table for twelve months. Even when it comes to vaccination. By the way, politicians did that very, very cleverly. In the beginning it was “vaccination yes or no”, then it was “vaccination” and meanwhile the discussion is only about the question “which vaccine”. That is to say, they have mentally opened a door into which even critics or those who are at odds may run into. Even they are now unaware that they are no longer thinking about the subject of “vaccination, yes or no”, but rather about the question of “which vaccine should it be”. They drive us to where they want us spiritually. You kind of give us this spiritual one
Thinking framework, which is minimal. And that’s where we think we’re moving and making decisions. No, we are exactly in this small framework that is presented to us and they’ll probably laugh themselves half-dead when they see that.
I can imagine it’s like the Muppet Show with the two old men in the box. You sit there laughing at how well it works.
I laugh less there. I catch myself on some days when I feel very bad mentally myself. Some days I can hardly take it anymore. And I already notice that I am already partially taking it with me into the dream and processing it. If you, like you and me, deal with it hours a day, then it gets down to business. And I deal with Corona, the pandemic, hours a day. That won’t pass me by either.
I find it particularly dramatic that it is so difficult to reach people. You hit them with the truth, but they turn around and say: “Nope” or they say: “Yes but”. There are reasons for that. Once we have formed an opinion, we don’t want to revise it. For the simple reason that we then have to admit that we made a mistake. And that’s why we just defend our opinion.
Viviane Fischer
Some have already invested a lot. You fooled the child with the mask because you thought it was great yourself. Then you may not have been able to visit relatives when they were bad. And having to say in retrospect that I wasn’t at Grandma’s when she was so dirty that my job is gone, my business is gone, that can’t be all because of some kind of fraud.
Katy Pracher-Hilander
Exactly. This is the classic “sunk cost effect”[https://de .wikipedia.org/wiki/Versunkene_Kosten] . That means there are sunk costs that have to be justified at some point. And then I just wait for it, if I have to, forever.
Either it is about the time factor. That means that everyone has already invested a lot of time. Among them were many restaurateurs who were put off by politicians with a few handouts. But there is still no solution in sight. The time has now passed, you have already invested eleven months. Then they are already in this “sunk cost effect”. That means, you can no longer revise it, it does not go back. This “sunk cost effect” does not only apply to material things, it also applies to time and other resources that I have already invested, including intellectual resources.
And that is a crux of this “sunk cost effect”. Actually it comes from the “prospect theory”[https://de .wikipedia.org/wiki/Prospect_Theory] von Kahneman and Tversky, two psychologists who received the 2002 Nobel Prize in Economics for their findings. Psychologists said in 1972 that man is a very bad thinker, downright a catastrophe. That’s why it’s like this: once people have invested in one direction, you can’t get it out of there. That is the “sunk cost effect”. Incidentally, that is the problem why so many companies are doing so badly, because despite better knowledge they keep investing in a track and don’t pull the rip cord in time. We have the same here now. That means, if a politician would want to pull the ripcord somewhere, it means that we have invested money, we have invested time and then we wait for it. Although I don’t know any politician who would actually really want to change something here.
In Austria it is Herbert Kickl [MP (FPÖ) in the Austrian National Council]. He is the only opposition politician who really stands up and speaks plain language. People need a lot of courage, because they are massively attacked within the party and of course also from the outside, of course. But even he cannot score with facts. Yesterday [24. March 2021] there was another meeting of the Austrian National Council, with live broadcast. Kickl did something very, very simple. He’s got the NBC video[https://www .youtube.com=””] quoted by Albert Bourla, CEO of Pfizer.
I also had this video translated. I will gladly let you taste it. I had it translated, transcribed. Because I’d like to get that around. Be sure to listen.
The video is from February 25, 2021. Albert Bourla definitely says for 45 minutes that Pfizer doesn’t know anything. This is an experiment, he says literally, and that you have to wait for the data first. We don’t know if the vaccine will protect against infection, he says. We don’t know whether it protects against severe disease, he says. We don’t know what he’s doing at all. We have to wait for the dates.
All for 45 minutes. Albert Bourla doesn’t lie in this video. Herbert Kickl backed up his statements yesterday, of course, and brought the video as an argument. I don’t believe that he was heavily criticized for it afterwards, even though he speaks of facts. The statements in the video are not a political opinion, this is Pfizer’s CEO. That’s the one who’s selling us the vaccines right now. This is the one who just signed the treaty with Israel. That is, when you’re not even a Pfizer boss anymore
believes who tells us all this very clearly and clearly in the face, but rather the little buffoon from next door, yes, then we are really deep in the shit.
That’s bad.
[Information from Katy Pracher-Hilander on publications by Pfizer about her pseudo-study on the effect of the vaccine in the “New England Journal of Medicine”, late 2020 / early 2021]
Reiner Fuellmich
But it’s been noticeable for quite a while. For me it started at the latest when I heard Mr. Wieler. You think he doesn’t have all the cups in his cupboard, he sits down there in all seriousness and says: “We’ll have a vaccine, what kind of one, I don’t know whether it will do anything, I don’t know either, but we will will have a vaccine. ” Of course that’s part of that psychological strategy, I realize that by now. Just come out with all the boldness and no one will believe that what we are up to here is actually what we want. That seems to work, probably for a great many.
But there is this saying attributed to Abraham Lincoln: “You can deceive some people forever. You can fool everyone for a while too. But you cannot fool everyone forever. ” And we hope for that, also for this effect that you described for the twelve jurors. But I can very well imagine that a lot of people are on the verge of despair again and again. It’s no different for us.
Katy Pracher-Hilander
So, I always hope that there are now fewer and fewer people, especially in the media, who can endure the situation and support what is happening. That maybe over time it is a little too little for them to hide behind others and that they are morally responsible for something. I hope so. I try to do my part to make it so. I am now trying to do educational work with guest articles in “Wochenblick”, a magazine in Austria, so that people simply start to reflect on themselves, to get a little bit of thought.
And I hope that the police, doctors and journalists in particular come to think about it. These are basically the three pillars that can cause the whole thing to tip over. I call these three groups the weak points in the system. If only one of these three systems falls away, the rest of them will collapse. If they don’t go along with it, then they simply can no longer maintain this construct of lies. If, for example, the police no longer take part. So far, I think the police in Germany have been quite massive. They are even a little harder than the police in Austria. In Austria they are, I have to say, really still very humane. There are always individuals who leave. But I can’t yet imagine images like those from Germany in Austria. As I see it here, the police are still working according to the rules, always in such a way that they do not have to do too much in the direction of a violation or violation of human rights. So they really try to keep themselves in check. Then I look over to Germany with concern because I saw really dramatic pictures from the police. But I would say these three pillars are crucial.
If I’m on our side, I would try to start somewhere to shake things up. And, thank God, the police in Austria are on the right track. You will of course get a lot of pressure after the demos, where they say they weren’t tough enough.
One hundred percent. And then they were partly already last time. But by and large they were still very friendly. But the pressure from above will increase. That means it is our duty to strengthen these groups from the social side and to say: “Hey, if you are there for us, we are also there for you.” Encourage you to show that you are not alone in this. I try as best I can through educational work. I explain things as simple as the “Asch Conformity Experiment” or that
“Milgram Experiment”. I transfer that to the present so that you can reflect a little: “Where am I right now?” And “What is happening to me right now?”
Reiner Fuellmich
I think this educational work, as you explained earlier, makes perfect sense to me. Don’t overload people with too many topics, just confront them with a few topics in such a way that they can verify what we are saying. That they can then form their own opinion from it. Also the legal. Everyone is now calling for the lawyers because, in the end, they have always made the decision. There may also be progress in politics, although I have ever increasing doubts that any political party will make a difference, but that it has to be a political movement as a whole. And it is becoming more and more obvious.
I see the legal efforts in Austria, including colleagues Dr. Brunner, Beneder and Forsthuber. I think that’s great, because they are super self-confident and they just know that they will make it. We assume that too. That is why I believe that it is all the more important that we network in a closed international network in Austria, Germany and Italy. Especially when it comes to the legal procedure. We must not allow ourselves to be chased into any kind of activism, but we have to think through the plans with the best people sensibly and down to the last detail so that nothing goes wrong.
Because what has just happened in the USA was avoidable. An urgent application went wrong there. Obviously not enough work has been done. Maybe it’s something worse. We’ll find out now. But this happens when you don’t work properly enough and maybe work with the wrong people.
Viviane Fischer
I would be interested in something else, namely the cognitive and emotional availability of people. If I have committed myself to a point of view and then I experience a joyful or negative shock, could that move me to question that point of view? One negative shock could be, for example, that I realize that these vaccines are now much more toxic than I thought. And then I wonder how it can be that the government, which in my view is doing everything to overcome the crisis, accepts this serious damage with sight and does not even issue a warning. Could this be one of those places where a point of view gets a big shake? Or there is a happy constellation, let’s say it’s cooler to be on the other side. How do you see it, how could emotionality penetrate such a complicated conviction constellation.
Katy Pracher-Hilander
So how could one really use emotionality?
Viviane Fischer
Yes, could it be a lever?
Reiner Fuellmich
Emotional and artistic, too. That is partly related. For example, we have now experienced that the world-famous singer Nena has now come out with her opinion and has now created clear relationships. I spoke to her for a long time beforehand and it was clear that she had our opinion, but she was hesitant, for understandable reasons. But now she’s come out. That makes a huge difference, because it will be very difficult to tell her “you are an anti-Semite” or “you are right-wing radical”. Kati Witt has also joined. That will also have consequences. Now is that a good way to go over this emotional and artistic side?
Katy Pracher-Hilander
Definitely, because the other side also used the emotional route, but in a negative sense. This grandma-grandpa line is also about emotions.
Reiner Fuellmich
Those are very dull emotions, it’s all just negative.
Katy Pracher-Hilander
The other side has also instrumentalized with emotions. Yes, of course you can counteract the same with emotions. But you just have to see which emotions and how do I get them going, how can I trigger them. But of course we have to have an appropriate counterweight. Because people already have emotions. And it makes them sad when they are responsible for the lives and deaths of others. You can say a thousand times: “Can’t you do arithmetic? Have you never had math in your life? The probability that you will have a really serious problem with Corona is mathematically almost impossible. ” Who gets vaccinated against something that is almost impossible because it is supposedly so dangerous? With a vaccine from which more and more young women are now dying who, mathematically speaking, would not have had the chance of seriously having a problem with Covid-19? But we sacrifice them and everyone looks the other way. It does not matter.
This means that the crowd is so hypnotized that you can’t even begin to dock anywhere with normal factual facts. With them everything is already grafted with the garbage that has been littered with them. We can actually imagine it a bit like vaccination. It’s like the virus that has to dock somewhere. All the control centers are already crammed full of some kind of garbage, not entirely unintentionally, so that new information can no longer find anything where it can dock. There is nowhere else to land.
Reiner Fuellmich
When you said that the other side works with emotions, I thought, yes, it actually does, but not an offer. That is only negative. They have nothing positive. Perhaps that really has to be pointed out. We have something to offer. We have positives. We have art. We have empathy, we have funny people to offer if we have to. It is noticeable: the others have no sense of humor. Even if they wanted to, they couldn’t tell a joke.
Katy Pracher-Hilander
Or if so, then a bad one. Yes, that means we already have a lot of instruments in hand. We just have to really do the same psychological approach.
Only our challenge is greater than ours. For the other side, these primitive 08/15 basic psychology methods are enough. For example, the constant stimulation of the attention span, that’s on purpose. But we have to sit down and do our homework properly so that we actually pick people up and don’t get shipwrecked, because time is a factor. She runs, runs and runs and now comes the green pass, which is introduced very ingeniously step by step.
And as a psychologist, by the way, I say we have very banal marketing strategies here when it comes to the vaccine. How to introduce him to society.
Why, by the way, in Israel? We know why in Israel. Because Israel is a taboo zone. You can’t question it critically. It is assumed that nothing will ever happen that is unethical or immoral. It’s just a bubble in the head. You can’t make a counter-argument at all, it’s a taboo zone. If you had asked me, hey, what country in the world are we starting in? I would also have said in Israel. No country is as good for marketing as Israel.
Reiner Fuellmich
Israel has certainly been pushed to the fore as a symbol. The actual decision, however, will be made in Europe and, above all, probably in Germany. These are the battleground states, so to speak.
Katy Pracher-Hilander
In Europe Austria was pushed forward. Europe, i.e. Austria, laid the red carpet for you in Germany. Not without reason either. I noticed that straight away. Of course, this is also a sales psychological trick. Because a country like Germany has a rather difficult history. So if Germany comes around the corner with a green passport, so to speak with a stigmatization of certain population groups, I can’t sell that well in Europe. What have you done? I’ll take every bet that it would turn out that way. First, Kurz brought the issue into play here in Austria, then Merkel briefly said, “Hmm difficult”, because of possible discrimination, because of the distinction between vaccinated and not vaccinated. But 24 hours later it was suddenly okay. Suddenly Merkel changed her mind and then suddenly said: “Yes, it will be the same for us in June.” That is, they didn’t even bother to put a relatively longer period in between. 24 hours were enough for Austria to lay the slide for Germany. So Germany, with its special history, was fine and you can now establish the thing very well there in terms of marketing.
That means, you have to look at such processes from the real meta perspective in order to understand how the other person ticks and how they work. And for the most part they work very, very primitively, as we have seen. But some things are planned well in advance and don’t happen by chance.
Viviane Fischer
There will be some kind of command center. Because the measures are very similar everywhere. You can hardly imagine that all of this happens by chance, for example when Kurz comes out, says something, and Merkel jumps on it immediately afterwards. A large agency may also be involved, for example “Hill + Knowlton Strategies” or other people.
Katy Pracher-Hilander
After seeing the handwriting of psychologists here – and it is very similar globally, it will hardly be possible that every country has hired psychologists for itself to see, let’s go ahead. Then these parallels would not be so noticeable. That would be over-coincidental if everyone was acting relatively in line, but everyone would have their own control center. So you have to assume that there is something like an overarching guide. And then there are country-specific variants. Depending on what makes people tick in each country. The culture factor is a big factor.
And what is of course also clear, there are countries on the globe that are important and others are less important. And the important ones have to act accordingly first. And unfortunately, Austria is likely to play a central role, there is no other way of explaining the behavior of Kurz & Co. Similar to Israel, our neutrality gives us a very large trust-giving role, also because we are so small and inconspicuous. In other words, nobody would assume that anything bad is up in the air in Austria. That means that Austria has a very good status for selling something out into the world. This image that we have of the individual countries has simply established itself in people’s minds over the years. That is of course a good basis, if you pay attention to it, you are quite solid on the road.
Viviane Fischer
Austria certainly also plays a major role for Germany. I believe that everything that happens in Austria is particularly noticed in Germany. And of course we are already a very important country.
Katy Pracher-Hilander
Yes, that’s exactly what I meant. We’re a little bit the vanguard. We’ll have to lay out the red carpet for you. It’s a symbiosis.
Reiner Fuellmich
We see this nasty game where the real actors are in the background.
But a lot of puppets are needed out there. One thing is very noticeable to me. If some of these marionettes do identify themselves as a person, then they are consistently unsympathetic people. They are those who have some serious problem with them. This applies to politicians as well as to journalists. One of the journalists is out and about who apparently has a serious problem with women. He even wrote about it and now he’s bolting around.
I really think we have to offer something really positive on the emotional level and we can do that. They can’t do that. They have absolutely no possibility, and precisely for these reasons. They have no way of doing it at all. Only we can do it.
Katy Pracher-Hilander
Yes, it’s true that the others are more like vampires. They just suck everything out until the last bit of life is breathed out. Until there are only zombies left. That is actually the case, this mask madness, which was introduced relatively early, and also these contradictions, mask in the subway yes, mask in the subway no.
This is psychological warfare, by the way, to make people feel insecure. Insecure, no longer know your way around at all. You practically move mentally in a circle. You are completely confused. All of this is not accidental. We just know that from war psychology. If we were commanders now, we would also sit down and say, great, now let’s do the manual. What kind of instruments do we have? How shall we do it? And then there will be some nonsense too.
The mask has another effect. I’ll put it this way, she was a great idea.
She’s covering her face. And our face makes us psychological beings. That said, it is very important that we can read something on each other’s faces. And what it does now, of course, especially with children, is de-individualizing and dehumanizing them. And that’s where the whole thing should go. Humans should develop towards robots. Exactly. He should not be a psychological being, little social being, but rather function like a zombie, within the framework that is given to him. That’s why there was a lot of home office
prescribed, that makes sense. People are separated, there is little feeling, little emotion, little positive.
Reiner Fuellmich
We can counteract that. We will do that too.
Katy Pracher-Hilander
There are many groups. There is now a group on Telegram called KraftQuellen[https://t .me/Kraft_Quellen] formed who try to counteract and also give people tools of the trade. How can you motivate yourself positively. How can you draw strength. What can you do.
It is a central instrument of politics to take away people’s self-control. They did that at the very beginning. This is one of the central mechanisms that they work with. To deprive people of any possibility of self-control through this hiccup. They no longer have the ability to control their life, that’s why it goes back and forth every 14 days, lockdown yes, lockdown no, so that one cannot plan a life. So that one kinks completely. And I said right at the beginning that sooner or later the children would be taken on board so that the last ones could be given over to the parents. That was clearly predictable, that didn’t surprise me at all. That was very clear. And I just wonder what else they’d come up with. I said months ago that it will then
Arriving in such a way that the supermarkets close or the shops close, that is the next step. We are already there. Is already on the table. It’s actually not difficult to predict and predict what will happen next. If you think along a little and look a little at the chronology, then that is relatively easy to see.
Viviane Fischer
It’s also interesting that new problems keep emerging. Yesterday there was a demo of haulage companies and farmers in Berlin. Something is brewing on the rural front, because there are new insect destruction laws. Certain insects are no longer allowed to be destroyed, for example the bark beetle or flies. The efforts to concentrate in agriculture are also promoted by the fact that farmers now have to draw a broader natural strip of ten meters around their field. Of course, a large farmer can do that, because with his huge field there is no problem to reveal ten meters. But the little farmer can’t do it and then he loses his livelihood. The farmers had teamed up with the haulage contractors. They also say that in principle they are on the verge of death because they are less at the moment
Can make sales. The hint came, “we will drive the food that is then on your table”. That could be an indication of future bottlenecks. There
you can already imagine a lot.
Reiner Fuellmich
But let’s not despair, because that is exactly the goal they are pursuing. We see that and when you see something, you can act.
If you can’t see something, you mostly make mistakes.
Viviane Fischer
I would like to say one more thing. I feel reminded of a movie. There is a scene about the importance of the second follower. One sees a
Rock concert, people hang around there, and then a somewhat plump guy dances to himself and looks a bit strange. Then everyone looks, the freak dances in
a bit silly, but then a second one joins them. That already has an effect, you think, the first one can’t be that crazy if there is a second one
comes to that. Then the third one comes in and suddenly there is a crowd and the party begins. At some point they all get up and the whole meadow is dancing.
At the moment I can see that we are in a very critical phase. Spring is coming. People want out. It’s already springtime outside. Many
do not want to be held in this desolation any longer. I think that’s really such a sticking point now. Many also feel this political Easter debacle,
however you try to interpret it now. When people think about what life actually is, then the others look pretty old.
Katy Pracher-Hilander
It was enough to get started. You don’t even have to convert someone. It is enough to sow doubts. [ Reiner Fuellmich : So that the questions are asked.] Yes
Exactly, that means, you don’t have to turn 100 percent of your thoughts around, just sow a little doubt. So that everyone in
alternatively looking for information or listening to something during a quiet moment. And then maybe the Corona Committee will see what was previously taboo,
because then there are only conspiracy theorists. But a bit of interest there. I think if you can do that, we’ll be in the positive direction
on the go, then it will hopefully become a bit of a self-separator.
Reiner Fuellmich
You may also be familiar with this cartoon with the board lying over an abyss. On one side, above the abyss, stands a Hitler-like person who pulls up his right arm and says, “You will be vaccinated. We will vaccinate you and if not there will be sanctions ”. And on the other side of the board, above the solid floor, there are 20 people. The first one turns around and says “I do not consent”, “I do not participate”. Everyone can tell if they would all get off the board, the man crashes.
Katy Pracher-Hilander
That’s it. When people realize where the lever is that we’ve been holding in our hands for twelve months. That’s the perverse thing about it. It is exactly like that.
And once that starts to seep, the other side has a real problem and that in no time at all. Then they have a problem overnight. And then I can say that you really have to go to the moon, because then it will be bad for these people on earth.
Reiner Fuellmich
In the next week we come at the usual hour. Then we want to give you a little courage. Perhaps we can also win over Ms. Pracher-Hilander again, who can tell something about how one can overcome anxiety. Because that’s exactly what holds us tight, that’s all that holds us tight. We don’t see reality anymore. We only see the illusion that is being played to us.
Katy Pracher-Hilander
We just have to try again to free the mind from this veil. To show the light again and empower people to become master of their own senses.
Reiner Fuellmich
The other day we were at the demo in Kassel. There were just normal people there. We’re all normal people, Viviane is a normal person, I am a normal person.
We are actually all normal people and it is important that this becomes clear. We are all completely normal people, nobody has to be strong as a bear. But if we are
just tie up, then we can make the whole thing tip over and that’s what we’re going to do.
Katy Pracher-Hilander
I am there. I support that.
Viviane Fischer
I would like to briefly introduce the banner flyer project. Many have probably already noticed that. There are planes that are now flying around advertising the Corona Committee on a banner. We get more and more hits on the site, which we are very happy about. We are now in the process of making the site a bit more accessible, also with shorter videos, for people who are just starting out. Anyway, I think the banner flyers are a really great project. Anyone who would like to support this is welcome to do so. I’m not exactly sure where to find them. We can always post it on the channel. This meaningful action carries our discussion out into the real world. We would like to keep in touch with you too.
Katy Pracher-Hilander
Yes, really, very much. By the way, I’m happy that I was able to be there today. One of your employees contacted me and said that before we contact the pastor, we will contact a social psychologist again, because then it’s the end of the day. If that doesn’t work either, it would be bad. So I hope we all save the pastor, don’t we?
Reiner Fuellmich
It won’t work any other way. The churches have all failed so badly. They have already done that and this was the second chance. In the Third Reich they have
totally failed and here again. That was the last chance, there won’t be another chance.
Katy Pracher-Hilander
They won’t get any more from me. No go. We take it into our own hands, otherwise it won’t work.
Reiner Fuellmich
There is no other way. So we stay that way. We do something with the group of people, scientists like you who can explain, based on evidence, how to get out of this fear. And how you can use it to regain the freedom you need to be able to act.
Katy Pracher-Hilander
Perfect, wonderful. I’m looking forward to the round.
Viviane Fischer
We are again at the end of a very intense session. What came out of that. We thank everyone for watching. We are making the call for donations again for OvalMedia, who support us technically, and also for us, for other projects that we will announce shortly.
Reiner Fuellmich
We show the banner flyers again.
Viviane Fischer
We are sending the link to the banner flyers again via the Telegram channel, because this is a great project. In spite of everything, we wish you a fruitful day and a nice weekend. I’ll see you again next week. Until then, thank you very much.
